19 for sale in my area

[rojoyinc]

NEver heard of this cat - but there is a supercat 19 for sale near. It was like expertly redone... painted, and looks like showroom. Dagger boards and rudders look like brand new (plastic) so REALLY EXPERTLY PAINTED.

Sails very poor - no battens, mouse holes, jib zipper shot. (where to get new? only custom made?)

Tramp was custom made very nice (new shape) with an attached mesh gear bag).

He's asking 3200 with trailer. It's SO PRETTY but sails? and really can't use it with nasty sails due to jib zipper being shot.
I have been a Hobie 16 owner (had 5 a couple weeks ago) I picked up a great deal on H18 - sold off extra's and got the boat and trailer for really nothing. Sails in "SUPERB shape".

(sails not compatible?) looked like the cut was quite different. Anyway - LACK of parts and rarity of the supercat has me leery.
But the videos on yourtube and reviews make it attractive. Yet, I can get parts used for my hobies on craiglist quite often.

Good boat? any thing to look for that might make it bad (Do they get soft spots like old Hobies?)
VAlue? I offered 1500 as is - 1800 if jib zipper was fixed.

any tips? thanks so mu ch

Ron Kramer in Michigan.

[gahamby]

Well, you're in the right church. The pew you want is: http://www.aquarius-sail.com/
New sails won't be cheap. The guy to call is Tom. That asking price without sails is high.
There's lots to learn in these forums. I'm real new and still learning. SCs are awesome boats.
post pics if you can, that will up your reply rate. Good luck, GH

[Mac M]

I'm pretty sure I've seen the ad for the boat your talking about. If its the same one I called the guy about it when I was looking for another boat. It looks like he did a really nice job on the boat, not sure why he stopped at the sails. Unfortunately you don't see a whole lot of used 19 sails out there. You can get any parts you need straight from Aquarius, and the customer service is phenomenal!!

[rojoyinc]

I clicked the other pew - but brought me to their website (no forum?)
I asked for a price on new sails to see how much if I were to get the 19 foot at a more fair price.

I can get used (cheap) hobie H18 and 16 parts all over = ( wont' happen on the super cat I suspect.

Here you requested photos - has like new tramp with mesh stow bag that snaps on.
has sails - but really poor (battens are pvc pipe)

Boat and mast are beautiful though.

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[gahamby]

This is the forum. With Aquarius, you just have to call 'em. They have the stuff. If the seller comes off the price to the tune of a set of sails you might have something.

[havliii]

Ron,

F.W.I.W. Sails on a cat = the engine in a car. The question is what is the value of a used car w/o the engine or at best a broken one? I always look at the sails first and the hulls last. The quality of the sails drives the gross price not the shine on the hulls. My old beater 19 will blow the doors off most anyone, why? The sails and battens are 'like new!' (more auto talk)

The double wrap tramp is problematic in that you will have the old style traveler on this boat, this is a major P.I.T.A. The hard track Harken is the only way to go on the Supercats. (more $) If you have the coin to finish this project it will be a scream machine and a real head turner, you'll not regret it. Your offer seems appropriate to me but probably not to the seller, he's emotionally invested in the paint job.

Good luck.

[SC15Av8or]

Ron,

F.W.I.W. Sails on a cat = the engine in a car. The question is what is the value of a used car w/o the engine or at best a broken one? I always look at the sails first and the hulls last. The quality of the sails drives the gross price not the shine on the hulls. My old beater 19 will blow the doors off most anyone, why? The sails and battens are 'like new!' (more auto talk)

The double wrap tramp is problematic in that you will have the old style traveler on this boat, this is a major P.I.T.A. The hard track Harken is the only way to go on the Supercats. (more $) If you have the coin to finish this project it will be a scream machine and a real head turner, you'll not regret it. Your offer seems appropriate to me but probably not to the seller, he's emotionally invested in the paint job.

Good luck.

What Havliii and others say is all true !!! Havliii learned all he says about the traveler the hard way as I tried to convince him of this when I did my SC15 that changing the traveler is a must do . It is simple to DIY it as I did. I might have even posted here me building up the SC15 I know I did the SC19. Bought parts second hand from ebay....Tdive5.....track and end stops I got from west marine. Some bolt rope track and you can convert current tramp to back with a bolt rope to accommodate the traveler. Tom sells that bolt rope track kit as well. Or see if you can find a used rear crossbar with built in track. Yes the specific Supercat parts are limited but there are a lot of generic parts as well. Most parts from a SC15 or SC17 fit the SC19 as well. Kind of like the H14 and H16. I have a SC19 too and have found that most cats of the same size parts will work till you can get the right part in from either Tom or else where. There are other companies that have made sails for these cats as well. One of them the owner used to work for Hobie. I run a NACRA 5.5 mylar sail on my SC19. The original required a lot of work to fix but Ulman sails hooked me up there and I can run with Havliii on my SC19 and SC15

All I can say is Once you go SUPERCAT you won't go BACK !!!! You drive these boats like you stole them. Forget the H way!!! Drive the bows down...It is EXTREMELY hard to pitch pole these.. both hulls have to be buried past front crossbar . You will look at ruff water in a different way as these cats eat it for breakfast and flat water is a DRAG RACE !!! These are tanks too as I have hit (they don't call me Capt. John Gunwhales crash for nothing AHRGGG!! ) many a thing from posts to sea walls, to every dock we sail from to a H16 (it lost by the way) and yet they keep going !!!!

The customer service is great !! More companies out there could take a lesson or two from Matt and Tom. The info here on this site and from fellow SC drivers is great and all are more than willing to share and lend some advice and help. If you don't get this one..... where did you say this was listed at ?? If you need any more convincing get a ride on one.

[Kevin Keller]

Personally it looks like a good deal to me. When you consider how much work it takes to get a boat in good shape, that is a small price. To me sails are easy to replace but getting a basic boat in good shape is the most important thing. I am assuming he did a nice job.

What would a new comparable boat cost? Quite a bit more I suppose. Price a new daggerboard or rudder alone.

I think converting it to a traveler track would not be that difficult and something you could do in the future.

[Bruiser]

Personally it looks like a good deal to me. When you consider how much work it takes to get a boat in good shape, that is a small price. To me sails are easy to replace but getting a basic boat in good shape is the most important thing. I am assuming he did a nice job.

What would a new comparable boat cost? Quite a bit more I suppose. Price a new daggerboard or rudder alone.

I think converting it to a traveler track would not be that difficult and something you could do in the future.

I would agree, sails are cheap in the big picture. My way of justifying news sails...they are like gas for a powerboat. A power boater will drop thousands on gas every year. We should look at sails the same way. Budget thousands a year for sails and sails actually become pretty cheap. If you sail a lot, sails should be refreshed every 3 years. However, most beach cats never get new sails. So get a good boat and add a new set of sails and you have a really good program going...

[havliii]

A power boater will drop thousands on gas every year. We should look at sails the same way. Budget thousands a year for sails and sails actually become pretty cheap.

Your metaphor is absurd. Sails=engine on a sail boat not the fuel, wind=fuel on a sailboat and that is free.

[Bruiser]

A power boater will drop thousands on gas every year. We should look at sails the same way. Budget thousands a year for sails and sails actually become pretty cheap.

Your metaphor is absurd. Sails=engine on a sail boat not the fuel, wind=fuel on a sailboat and that is free.

Oh good grief! Then never mind. That 30 year old sail will be perfect. Have fun with the free stuff....

[havliii]

A power boater will drop thousands on gas every year. We should look at sails the same way. Budget thousands a year for sails and sails actually become pretty cheap.

Your metaphor is absurd. Sails=engine on a sail boat not the fuel, wind=fuel on a sailboat and that is free.

Oh good grief! Then never mind. That 30 year old sail will be perfect. Have fun with the free stuff....

Bruiser,

Here's my point, (hypothetical case, Ok) if you went to buy your RC27 and you find that the sails were complete rags, would you pay the seller full value or negotiate a discount on the price? If you went to buy a fishing boat and you find that the engine was seized would you pay full value or negotiate a discount?

This thread was based on the questionable value of the original package (boat + some mouse eaten rags for sails). I still maintain that if the sails offered with the boat are rags then a sizable discount on the package is reasonable. If the buyer pays full price on the package and then needs to purchase new sails at 3-4K (which IMHO is expensive) then the deal is no deal at all.

Speaking strictly for myself I can't afford, nor would I sink 6-10K into a SC19, not enough bang for the buck, but I don't begrudge someone who is willing and wants to. The original poster was looking for opinions, a variety of them can be found here. That is the wonderful part of forums, opinions and freedom of speech.

Regards,
Andy

P.S. I don't sail with 30 y.o. blown out sails, I like to find and purchase used catamarans that include great sails or if that is not the case I negotiate a discount on the purchase so that I may use the remaining balance of my 'budget' to purchase new sails. Expensive is a very subjective word and varies with each individual.

[SC15Av8or]

P.S. I don't sail with 30 y.o. blown out sails, I like to find and purchase used catamarans that include great sails or if that is not the case I negotiate a discount on the purchase so that I may use the remaining balance of my 'budget' to purchase new sails. Expensive is a very subjective word and varies with each individual.

I do !!! And they do just fine. My SC19 is a 1985 and the sails were confirmed vintage and antiques by Matt Habberman. In my thread where I show my rebuild to the point it is Matt chimes in on my sails and the make Dave Posey.

Slight correction on the sail history. Dave Posey was the original sailmaker who did all of the development work with Bill Roberts. While other sailmakers were involved over the years, we continued to work with Dave until his retirement in the early 2000's.

Regarding colors of the sails, the green one is a Fresco which is one of the original color schemes offered by Boston Whaler. The other one however I believe is actually POST Boston Whaler. Prior to Boston Whaler the majority of the sails were white with a single colored panel up near the logo. In the mid-1980's we offered what was called "custom" colors where the person ordering the sail got to choose their sail colors and where the colors went on the sail, the other colored sail looks like a "custom" color to me which would make it a mid to late 90's vintage. It also appears that it is a SuperCat logo on the sail, that style logo was introduced POST Boston Whaler if I am not mistaken.

Hope the history helps.

Yes they needed a bit of TLC from Ulman Sails but I can run with you Commodore....on a good day...

Here's the link to my post that shows how bad they were.

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