Raising my mainsail requires a lot of force (150+ lbs sometimes) and even with no sail my main halyard seems to have a lot of drag. Looking at the masthead sheave it doesn't seem too bad but it definately has some wear on it and the sheave at the bottom is a little worn as well. My sheaves are all aluminum without bearings (don't know if the new ones have bearings or not). Anybody have any ideas? I have tried cleaning the mast track and measuring for spots it might be pinching with no success. I have also applied McLube to the mast track with no improvement. I really think the problem is in the sheaves. Or another possibility is my halyard is too big, it is 5/16 but it doesn't look like it rubs very much and I think that is the correct size. Ideas?
Thanks,
Eric
SC20 #113
SC20 Main Halyard
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Tom Haberman
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Eric,
Lots of things to look at.
Halyard line of 5/16" diameter is awfully large. We use a maximum of 3/16" on new boats with aluminum masts and 5/32" diameter with carbon masts.
Sheaves are ball bearing at mast head and roller bearing at mast base.
I would toss the aluminum sheaves both top & bottom.
Have you always had this problem or is it getting worse?
Another big factor is the sail bolt rope. We use only 1/4" hard braid or 5/16 hard braid for bolt ropes. If you have any type of twisted bolt rope your are going to have problems. These soft bolt ropes pinch quite easily in the sail track and every time you feed in a bit of sail it gets worse.
We have a cut away entrance now on the mast, not the funnel type. The funnel type makes the pinching extremely troublesome because it will try and feed the sail in even if the bolt rope is pinched.
We use a sail feeder right at the entrance on carbon masts but it is not required on aluminum. We do use a sail leader that is extremely helpful in keeping the sail aligned with the track entrance.
The amount of luff round in the sail will also effect the raising process. Sails with alot of luff round can be a bear as you get the sail about half way up. Batten cap placement in realtionship to aft edge of bolt rope is very critical. If the caps are placed too far away you will get what I call batten poke ( sail pushes past mast on either side). This will also lead to very poor mast rotation and poor exit flow. The caps should be no further than 1/4" away from bolt rope.
If you have the old style wire to rope splice any of the above will not completely cure your probelm. The old style spliced halyard gets jammed alongside the bolt rope when it meets the headboard and once that happens it is almost impossible to raise the sail.
Hope this helps.
Lots of things to look at.
Halyard line of 5/16" diameter is awfully large. We use a maximum of 3/16" on new boats with aluminum masts and 5/32" diameter with carbon masts.
Sheaves are ball bearing at mast head and roller bearing at mast base.
I would toss the aluminum sheaves both top & bottom.
Have you always had this problem or is it getting worse?
Another big factor is the sail bolt rope. We use only 1/4" hard braid or 5/16 hard braid for bolt ropes. If you have any type of twisted bolt rope your are going to have problems. These soft bolt ropes pinch quite easily in the sail track and every time you feed in a bit of sail it gets worse.
We have a cut away entrance now on the mast, not the funnel type. The funnel type makes the pinching extremely troublesome because it will try and feed the sail in even if the bolt rope is pinched.
We use a sail feeder right at the entrance on carbon masts but it is not required on aluminum. We do use a sail leader that is extremely helpful in keeping the sail aligned with the track entrance.
The amount of luff round in the sail will also effect the raising process. Sails with alot of luff round can be a bear as you get the sail about half way up. Batten cap placement in realtionship to aft edge of bolt rope is very critical. If the caps are placed too far away you will get what I call batten poke ( sail pushes past mast on either side). This will also lead to very poor mast rotation and poor exit flow. The caps should be no further than 1/4" away from bolt rope.
If you have the old style wire to rope splice any of the above will not completely cure your probelm. The old style spliced halyard gets jammed alongside the bolt rope when it meets the headboard and once that happens it is almost impossible to raise the sail.
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Tom Haberman
Tom Haberman
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Tom Haberman
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Eric,
The best way to check luff round is to adjust all the battens and then stake out the three corners of sail. The luff round will be very evident.
Take a tape measure & hook it onto headboard just aft of bolt rope. Then pull tape down to tack just aft of bolt rope. You should be able to measure the amount of sail forward of the tape and locate just where the most luff round is located.
I would bet on bad sheaves because the original sails typically did not have a lot of luff round.
The best way to check luff round is to adjust all the battens and then stake out the three corners of sail. The luff round will be very evident.
Take a tape measure & hook it onto headboard just aft of bolt rope. Then pull tape down to tack just aft of bolt rope. You should be able to measure the amount of sail forward of the tape and locate just where the most luff round is located.
I would bet on bad sheaves because the original sails typically did not have a lot of luff round.
Sincerely,
Tom Haberman
Tom Haberman
Well I got the new sheaves installed with a 3/16" halyard and it did make an improvement, but it is still pretty tough. Now I am wondering if it is because of the hook at the head of the mast. I recall having it installed years ago so I know it isn't original. It is exactly centered with the sail track so the halyard has to go to either side and it deflects the halyard. Is the hooks supposed to be exactly centered or off to 1 side? It can also be tricky unhooking the sail, so maybe the 2 are related.
Thanks,
Eric
Thanks,
Eric
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Tom Peterson
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Raising the main
This is a band-aid, and not a fix - but give the main halyard to a friend standing astern of the boat. Have them walk backwards to raise the sail - it will be a lot easier using that person's legs than your arms - and you can guide the sail up the track.
Hobie 14, Hobie 16, saw the light, and am now Supercat 17
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thommerrill
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Matt Haberman
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Eric,
You could be right about the two problems being related. The halyard hook is not supposed to be centered on the sail track, it is slightly off to one side. The halyard rope, when pulled straight down the mast, should pass the hook without touching. It should be close, but not touching. There should have been a drawing locating the hook when you upgraded, you could check the hook location and maybe move it or you could try bending the hook slightly to clear the halyard. Bending the hook is probably only an option if you have the thinner hook (1/8") versus the heavy duty one we currently supply.
Thom's suggestion about checking the sail track for "pinch points" is also a very good suggestion.
You could be right about the two problems being related. The halyard hook is not supposed to be centered on the sail track, it is slightly off to one side. The halyard rope, when pulled straight down the mast, should pass the hook without touching. It should be close, but not touching. There should have been a drawing locating the hook when you upgraded, you could check the hook location and maybe move it or you could try bending the hook slightly to clear the halyard. Bending the hook is probably only an option if you have the thinner hook (1/8") versus the heavy duty one we currently supply.
Thom's suggestion about checking the sail track for "pinch points" is also a very good suggestion.
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davefarmer
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Eric,
I just got a new main from Skip Elliot, and what had been a dificult raising with the original main, became nearly impossible. I replaced the masthead sheave with one from Tom,, scrapped the original wire/rope halyard and hook for a 3/16" V100 halyard that's secured to a cleat at the mast base. I actually bought a halyard hook set up for the masthead but decided against installing it because of occaisional problems I had with my H18 set up.
It's still a bit tough to raise, but 90% improvement. What I do notice is that it's real easy to bind up if the sail is not in exactly the same plane as the mast, which can be remedied by rotating the mast with the rotation control arm, or altering the direction of the pull on the halyard as the main is raised. Same deal pulling it down, rotate the mast when it sticks til it frees up.
Dave Farmer
H16, SC 20 #55, Reynold 21
I just got a new main from Skip Elliot, and what had been a dificult raising with the original main, became nearly impossible. I replaced the masthead sheave with one from Tom,, scrapped the original wire/rope halyard and hook for a 3/16" V100 halyard that's secured to a cleat at the mast base. I actually bought a halyard hook set up for the masthead but decided against installing it because of occaisional problems I had with my H18 set up.
It's still a bit tough to raise, but 90% improvement. What I do notice is that it's real easy to bind up if the sail is not in exactly the same plane as the mast, which can be remedied by rotating the mast with the rotation control arm, or altering the direction of the pull on the halyard as the main is raised. Same deal pulling it down, rotate the mast when it sticks til it frees up.
Dave Farmer
H16, SC 20 #55, Reynold 21
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Matt Haberman
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Eric,
I wouldn't use rivets. I would take the mast cap off and thru-bolt with a philips head screw and nyloc nuts on the inside. The hook is under a lot of load and no matter what type of rivet you use it will loosen up over time. The thru-bolt is less likely to loosen and if it does you can always tighten it, unlike the rivet.
I wouldn't use rivets. I would take the mast cap off and thru-bolt with a philips head screw and nyloc nuts on the inside. The hook is under a lot of load and no matter what type of rivet you use it will loosen up over time. The thru-bolt is less likely to loosen and if it does you can always tighten it, unlike the rivet.